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	<title>Comments for Austro-Athenian Empire</title>
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	<description>&#34;Austro&#34; as in Rothbard and Wittgenstein, &#34;Athenian&#34; as in Aristotle and smashing-the-plutocracy.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 08 Feb 2012 21:57:22 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on Cordial and Sanguine, Part 19 by dL</title>
		<link>http://aaeblog.com/2012/02/04/cordial-and-sanguine-part-19/comment-page-1/#comment-369312</link>
		<dc:creator>dL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Feb 2012 21:57:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://aaeblog.com/?p=8734#comment-369312</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;
It was your wording, not necessarily your position, that prompted the comparison.
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Fair enough, but I stand by the position :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>
It was your wording, not necessarily your position, that prompted the comparison.
</p></blockquote>
<p>Fair enough, but I stand by the position <img src='http://aaeblog.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>Comment on Cordial and Sanguine, Part 19 by Roderick</title>
		<link>http://aaeblog.com/2012/02/04/cordial-and-sanguine-part-19/comment-page-1/#comment-369311</link>
		<dc:creator>Roderick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Feb 2012 20:08:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://aaeblog.com/?p=8734#comment-369311</guid>
		<description>It was your wording, not necessarily your position, that prompted the comparison.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It was your wording, not necessarily your position, that prompted the comparison.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Cordial and Sanguine, Part 19 by dL</title>
		<link>http://aaeblog.com/2012/02/04/cordial-and-sanguine-part-19/comment-page-1/#comment-369306</link>
		<dc:creator>dL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Feb 2012 10:25:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://aaeblog.com/?p=8734#comment-369306</guid>
		<description>yes, of course, with regards to Locke. I posted a rather long essay on the State of Nature.

http://rulingclass.wordpress.com/2011/12/07/essay-on-the-state-of-nature-part-i/

My position is more or less moral contractarianism, and i would dispute equating it with a refusal to gaze into galileo&#039;s telescope.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>yes, of course, with regards to Locke. I posted a rather long essay on the State of Nature.</p>
<p><a href="http://rulingclass.wordpress.com/2011/12/07/essay-on-the-state-of-nature-part-i/" rel="nofollow">http://rulingclass.wordpress.com/2011/12/07/essay-on-the-state-of-nature-part-i/</a></p>
<p>My position is more or less moral contractarianism, and i would dispute equating it with a refusal to gaze into galileo&#8217;s telescope.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Cordial and Sanguine, Part 19 by Roderick</title>
		<link>http://aaeblog.com/2012/02/04/cordial-and-sanguine-part-19/comment-page-1/#comment-369279</link>
		<dc:creator>Roderick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Feb 2012 20:25:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://aaeblog.com/?p=8734#comment-369279</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;The whole point of “the State of Nature construct” was to legitimize the rationality/necessity of self-ownership violations regarding government.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

That&#039;s its point in Hobbes.  But in Locke it has the &lt;em&gt;dual&lt;/em&gt; function of authorising government and placing constraints on government.  And over time, in one strand of liberalism at least, the second function waxed while the first function waned, until state-of-nature theory turned into an argument for anarchism.  It was to resist this tendency that a different strand of liberalism pushed farther and farther in the direction of hypothetical rather than actual consent (with public-reason contractualism being the latest flower on this vine).

&lt;blockquote&gt;To me it’s clear that there is no moral foundation for a libertarian social theory. I wouldn’t bother looking for it.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

&quot;I do not wish to approve of claims about which I do not have any knowledge, and about things which I have not seen; and then to observe through those glasses gives me a headache. Enough! I do not want to hear anything more about this.&quot; -- Cesare Cremonini</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>The whole point of “the State of Nature construct” was to legitimize the rationality/necessity of self-ownership violations regarding government.</p></blockquote>
<p>That&#8217;s its point in Hobbes.  But in Locke it has the <em>dual</em> function of authorising government and placing constraints on government.  And over time, in one strand of liberalism at least, the second function waxed while the first function waned, until state-of-nature theory turned into an argument for anarchism.  It was to resist this tendency that a different strand of liberalism pushed farther and farther in the direction of hypothetical rather than actual consent (with public-reason contractualism being the latest flower on this vine).</p>
<blockquote><p>To me it’s clear that there is no moral foundation for a libertarian social theory. I wouldn’t bother looking for it.</p></blockquote>
<p>&#8220;I do not wish to approve of claims about which I do not have any knowledge, and about things which I have not seen; and then to observe through those glasses gives me a headache. Enough! I do not want to hear anything more about this.&#8221; &#8212; Cesare Cremonini</p>
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		<title>Comment on Cordial and Sanguine, Part 19 by crossofcrimson</title>
		<link>http://aaeblog.com/2012/02/04/cordial-and-sanguine-part-19/comment-page-1/#comment-369273</link>
		<dc:creator>crossofcrimson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Feb 2012 14:10:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://aaeblog.com/?p=8734#comment-369273</guid>
		<description>Great post (and great discussion in the responses as well)!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post (and great discussion in the responses as well)!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Cordial and Sanguine, Part 19 by dL</title>
		<link>http://aaeblog.com/2012/02/04/cordial-and-sanguine-part-19/comment-page-1/#comment-369272</link>
		<dc:creator>dL</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Feb 2012 12:34:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://aaeblog.com/?p=8734#comment-369272</guid>
		<description>Actually, Vallier is just proposing an alternative liberal social contract: 

&quot;on which state coercion is permitted only when persons cannot reasonably reject the rules or principles on which the coercion is based.&quot; 

Of course, the problem is the enforceability of the constraint.

Historically, self-ownership, in liberal social contract theory, has never been &quot;too consequence-insensitive.&quot; The whole point of &quot;the State of Nature construct&quot; was to legitimize the rationality/necessity of self-ownership violations regarding government.

To me it&#039;s clear that there is no moral foundation for a libertarian social theory. I wouldn&#039;t bother looking for it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, Vallier is just proposing an alternative liberal social contract: </p>
<p>&#8220;on which state coercion is permitted only when persons cannot reasonably reject the rules or principles on which the coercion is based.&#8221; </p>
<p>Of course, the problem is the enforceability of the constraint.</p>
<p>Historically, self-ownership, in liberal social contract theory, has never been &#8220;too consequence-insensitive.&#8221; The whole point of &#8220;the State of Nature construct&#8221; was to legitimize the rationality/necessity of self-ownership violations regarding government.</p>
<p>To me it&#8217;s clear that there is no moral foundation for a libertarian social theory. I wouldn&#8217;t bother looking for it.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Cordial and Sanguine, Part 19 by Jason</title>
		<link>http://aaeblog.com/2012/02/04/cordial-and-sanguine-part-19/comment-page-1/#comment-369247</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 05 Feb 2012 07:28:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://aaeblog.com/?p=8734#comment-369247</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve always liked to phrase it that eudaimonism itself is the golden mean between deontology and utilitarianism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve always liked to phrase it that eudaimonism itself is the golden mean between deontology and utilitarianism.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Cordial and Sanguine, Part 19 by Michael</title>
		<link>http://aaeblog.com/2012/02/04/cordial-and-sanguine-part-19/comment-page-1/#comment-369241</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Feb 2012 18:27:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://aaeblog.com/?p=8734#comment-369241</guid>
		<description>Interesting post. Happy birthday, Roderick.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting post. Happy birthday, Roderick.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Who Copies the Copymen? by dennis</title>
		<link>http://aaeblog.com/2012/02/01/who-copies-the-copymen/comment-page-1/#comment-369222</link>
		<dc:creator>dennis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Feb 2012 06:15:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://aaeblog.com/?p=8719#comment-369222</guid>
		<description>But people are free to ignore the prequel.  When imagining the Star Wars universe I simply treat the prequels as bad fan fiction.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But people are free to ignore the prequel.  When imagining the Star Wars universe I simply treat the prequels as bad fan fiction.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Who Copies the Copymen? by Brandon</title>
		<link>http://aaeblog.com/2012/02/01/who-copies-the-copymen/comment-page-1/#comment-369218</link>
		<dc:creator>Brandon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Feb 2012 03:07:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://aaeblog.com/?p=8719#comment-369218</guid>
		<description>I find Hughes&#039; argument to be unconvincing. Moore didn&#039;t say it was because of the characters, he talked about the Watchmen piece at large, by referencing Moby-Dick. In the works Hughes mentioned, Lost Girls and The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, Moore took the characters and imagined them in a universe of his own creation. 

Moore and Gibbons already told the Watchmen characters&#039; back stories. We already know what we need to know about them. No further information is necessary. I would oppose the project even if Moore and Gibbons were behind it. I opposed the new Star Wars trilogy because Lucas was merely telling a story he had already told in the original trilogy.

I am not opposed to something like &quot;The Seven Percent Solution&quot; or &quot;The Private Life of Sherlock Holmes&quot; because we don&#039;t know much about the Holmes/Watson et al. characters. It&#039;s easy to add or subtract information in the same style as Doyle because we aren&#039;t given much information in the first place. Holmes&#039; personal history isn&#039;t relevant to the stories. The Watchmen characters&#039; biographies are integral to the larger Watchmen story. Re-writing those biographies could harm the way people think about the original story.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I find Hughes&#8217; argument to be unconvincing. Moore didn&#8217;t say it was because of the characters, he talked about the Watchmen piece at large, by referencing Moby-Dick. In the works Hughes mentioned, Lost Girls and The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, Moore took the characters and imagined them in a universe of his own creation. </p>
<p>Moore and Gibbons already told the Watchmen characters&#8217; back stories. We already know what we need to know about them. No further information is necessary. I would oppose the project even if Moore and Gibbons were behind it. I opposed the new Star Wars trilogy because Lucas was merely telling a story he had already told in the original trilogy.</p>
<p>I am not opposed to something like &#8220;The Seven Percent Solution&#8221; or &#8220;The Private Life of Sherlock Holmes&#8221; because we don&#8217;t know much about the Holmes/Watson et al. characters. It&#8217;s easy to add or subtract information in the same style as Doyle because we aren&#8217;t given much information in the first place. Holmes&#8217; personal history isn&#8217;t relevant to the stories. The Watchmen characters&#8217; biographies are integral to the larger Watchmen story. Re-writing those biographies could harm the way people think about the original story.</p>
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